Retirements

[JH-SanAntonio]

Very very tired of active young players retiring in a league that requires building them up before they can be useable.

JH

[Mario ADK]

Very very tired of active young players retiring in a league that requires building them up before they can be useable.

yep, and you obviously cannot do anything against it. Take a look at the stats of my young backup-HB:
Watson                  9att for 98yds  10.9(Avg)   52(long)    4TD(!!!)

i wanted him to have a few runs in order to keep him happy and he did the best out of it.

i mean would YOU retire with 4 TDs in one season of play??? i wouldn´t. he wasn´t HB5 or something, he was HB3 (and sometimes HB2). Need to retire? No!

[JH-SanAntonio]

Well, now, in your case... he was probaly worried that he'd get dished up in some horrifying "worst trade ever" scenario, so it's understandable

I lost a starting OL and starting DL. Both were active 3 year guys.

It won't hurt my team much, and I'm not complaining that *I* got hit with it. Just saying that we need to jump on Paul and get him to unretire the young guys when those things happen... or change all young players' names to "Bobby Phillips" so his unretire macro program automatically unretires them until they reach 10,000 yards

JH

[Niki]

But where is the line about to let players retire or not.

I lost as well R LB who would have been a starter next year. But if you start to unretire players where will be the line: 5 years and then when someone has a starter of 6 years that will retire we will get the same story as we have now. It is the programme that does his work, not that I am happy about it but I can life with it

[Mario ADK]

Just saying that we need to jump on Paul and get him to unretire the young guys when those things happen...

i hope you were joking.... that would be the next wrong thing the league can do after upgrading offense skills instead of downgrading those of the defense.....

i see it like that. players like Watson ore the other ones (and there are not too many of them i guess 3 or four) either
<) changed professional sports
<) became ministers (exspecially those of the Ohio-region, "gods country")
<) got sick and tired of G.W. and left the country

we won´t bring them back..... use your picks, draft is coming up anyway....

[JH-SanAntonio]

Heh, you and your downgrades.... You do realize that we'd been downgrading defenses for 10 years- and it never worked? It's a numbers thing. The way it's set now should hold things nicely.

The entire "arg 90 to be good!" thing is simply due to the fact that wherever you set the limits, people will try to reach them. We could cap offense at 80 and defense at 65... and everyone would have offensive guys in their high 70s and defensive guys in the low 60s. Just the way it is.

What's funny is that it was you who sent me an email a couple of months ago stating that my WR2 had lousy hands- at 90- so I should trade with you.

The way the stats work, a handful need to be pretty good; the rest have markedly diminishing returns beyond a certain point.


As to the whole retirements thing, it's easy to draw a line... don't let active players younger than 7 retire. If you leave them inactive, or he hits 7 this year... bye bye.

As to the whole "use your picks" thing... one could easily argue that "I DID use my picks, and they retired after 3 seasons, idiot!" or "hmmm... seems nearly all of my starters are guys I drafted, what's your point?". But rather than get into that sort of thing, I'll chalk it up instead to a typical Mario-Forum-Troll statement


If there was rhyme or reason to pre-7 retirements, I wouldn't worry about it; however, just like injuries, it's completely random, and rather annoying.

JH

[David-Montreal]

After the 2001 season, DE Shane Doyle retired, and he was at the time the top DL on the team, having 43 tackles and 10 sacks.  He probably retired because the team went 0-14.

Doyle, Shane             OK     1     70 70 78 82 69 71 73 71

While Akers was old, he was also a DE1/DE2, and started the entire year, but probably retired because we won it all.  24 tackles and 10 sacks as a good year for a 10th year player.

Akers, Steve             OK     9     73 77 74 85 66 72 72 74

I think you have your random players retire... some because they are old, some rookies, some from lack of playing time.  Also you have to figure in some because they are motivated by wins, losses and other GM controlled reasons.

[Mario ADK]

jason, once again you did not get my point regarding "downgrading defenses instead of upgrading offenses": what was done is to improve all offense players of the FWL intead of reducing all defense players, thus widening the gap between roster-players (offense) and free agents even more. FAs are basically useless stuff in the FWL right now. that was not the case back "in the good old days" where the gap was a "realistic" one.

Do YOU realise that using FAs is part of the game?

As for retirements of pre-7-players:
there are appr. 900 players on the roster, why do you have a problem if let us say 8 "younger" (3yrs or less) players retire due to reasons beyond our control? We are talking about less than 1% here, and probably 0,3% of starters. i have no figures of the NFL but i am pretty sure that is not an urealistic figure.

And even "huge superstars" like Ricky Williams retire. I just wonder what you would post here if your medium-aged superstar-HB would retire after having dominated the league.

So come on Jason..... 
Don´t get annoying with your idea of bringing them back "artificially". Case closed. Thanks.

[JH-SanAntonio]

Heheheh

Typical Mario forum flame... "I'm not sure what I'm talking about but I'll slam anything I see anyway!"

Explain to me how the mighty FAs play such a huge role in any season

In the early stages of the league, of COURSE the gap was closer, due to the fact there were few camps run. Once the R-2 types had a few camps behind them, you had a sizeable gap. FA guys aren't on teams for a reason, though if you'd like to start a few be my guest. Post-draft FA players represent veterans cut and those rookies that were dumped or not picked.

Comparing sim leagues to the NFL is rather silly, and I hope I don't have to get into all the reasons why.

I would say the same thing regardless of who retired from whatever team.

As to the "artifically" part... a great deal of things are managed in this league, as in any other. Idiotically penalizing defensive players a dozen points every season to benefit a dubious opinion regarding unwanted players would be a bit more "artificial", no?

And if you don't think there have been unretires in this league, I've got a bridge to sell you

JH

[Mario ADK]

answers in your text, jason

Explain to me how the mighty FAs play such a huge role in any season

==> knock, knock, knock. anyone listen???
Cmon, Jason....... did anyone say something about "huge roles"? no? NO! but you might give FAs a chance a backups from time to time. My retired young HB was a former FA and he scored 4 TDs this season. See what i want to say?

I would say the same thing regardless of who retired from whatever team.
==> my backup-HB retired. i would have a lot to complain about, but i don´t complain at all. it is just part of the game.

Idiotically penalizing defensive players a dozen points every season to benefit a dubious opinion regarding unwanted players would be a bit more "artificial", no?
==> ah... rewarding all offensive players is not? 
Jason PLEASE................. And a GM that wants his retired palyers back is VERY VERY dubious my friend.....

And if you don't think there have been unretires in this league, I've got a bridge to sell you
==> hmmm...... must have been your complaining all the time

so let us stop here, Jason, further discussion makes no sense. your complaining about retirements is useless. this is a pc-programm.  So live with it.

[Paul-London]

I think Mario has shown that signing FA's can help out a team

Mario did a great job of this in the early years of the FWL, yes most GM's are now a bit wiser but i've seen Mario make many trades the last season where he has used some FA's as tradebait bolted onto other trades to increase the value and it has worked.

As for unretiring players i dont like to do this at all and never have done.  Bobby Phillips playing till he reached 10,000 yards wasnt fixed.  The season before Marco wanted him to retire, he put him at HB I as sometimes this seems to increase the chances of this happening.  He wanted him to retire as he wasnt going to be a starter.  In the end he didnt retire and his last season was sadly just as a backup but Marco did start him for a week or two just so he had enough yards to get over 10,000.

If i used the unretire tool then it would annoy many people as in previous seasons most GM's have lost a young star.  I lost WR Dedric Smith who in his 9th season was 4th in the league with over 90 catches and he retired and i've lost players in the past.

The way i think is that these players (Like the real NFL Europe) join the NFL or even the CFL.  If there was a rule where most players would play till their 10th, 11th or 12th seasons then there would be even less trading by far.  Random retirements etc really help the league as then many teams need to get back into trading instead of doing nothing

[Paul-London]

And if you don't think there have been unretires in this league, I've got a bridge to sell you

Jason i do take offence to that.

I have never unretired a player.  If i 'fix' the league and basically make the league corrupt then in my mind it would be boring as hell.  If i knew each year who i would make retire or unretire and then try and decide who i want to win and lose in this league then i'm a very very sad person.

I spend a ton of free time doing the FWL and if everything was fixed then it would be crazy of me to spend so much free time doing something which is rigged.

I've had many good friends i know personally in the FWL in previous seasons and they havent won anything.  I'm good friends with other people in the league currently but they dont get any favours or unretirees etc.

Yes i must admit if i ran the retirements and 10 of the 18 starting QB's in the league retired then i must admit i would run the retirements again.  I've had some games in the past which finish 3-0 in overtime and both RB's on each side get 24 carries for -32 yards each.  Games like that i do re run but i keep a note of which team won and then i sim the game again and make sure the team who originally won get the win in the replay to be fair.  Sometimes simming games takes ages because of things like this as FBPro has some very weird goings on sometimes.

I purposely put Charlie Ward and Travian Smith on I slots hoping they would retire but they came back for another year which i didnt want.  I wanted Jon Kitna to retire last season as i knew he wouldnt be a starter this year and he wasnt but i didnt fix it so he would retire.

Please dont bring up conspiracies about corruption or cheating by me in the FWL unless its true and you have proof.  If i found out anyone in the league was cheating then i would penalise them (as i've done in the past).

[JH-SanAntonio]

<sigh>

I'm not sure why such simple things seem to escape you, Mario. I'll try once more, though...

Free agents did not become marginalized by a single 12 point offensive boost. They become marginalized due to the fact that drafted players get as many as 7 camps under their belts before they begin to age, often picking up 50-60 points along the way, and FAs come in at the same level each season. Many teams have FAs on their roster- picked up as rookies and trained. The great "early years" for FA pickups were that way because there had been so few camps applied to non-FAs.

And as to the "dubious" bit- if you're saying that I want to unretire only my own young players, go back, print out the post, and find where I stated that. Otherwise, lay off on the bolstering of your weak arguments with BS. I've been suggesting that we don't let players retire 'til they hit 7 since my 2nd season in the league. It's something that works quite well, in fact, and there a few guys in this league that plays in another one that does just that.

Paul... did anyone accuse you of cheating? Sheesh.

JH

[Paul-London]

I'm not saying at all that you want me to unretire only your younger players, i'm sure some other GM's might want the same but its just one of the facts that we've never done that before and it would be unfair on the GM's who had many good young players retire before.  I havent used the unretire tool once.

Didnt accuse me of cheating but kinda accused me of unretiring players in the past.  Believe me theres been some 'strange' goings on in the files i've seen recently with some certain players on a team so i'm keeping a strong hold on them this time